please help me to understand...

[smallhagrid]

I have been considering putting up a blog for some time, and maybe also a discussion board.
All the usual possibilities have been looked at and frankly I have trouble deciding which is good for me.
I never even knew this CMS existed until today !
Now suddenly I see raves about this and want to know more so I browse all over this site, and...:

1)
Right away I wonder - if this tool has it's own built-in forum/board module(s), then why is this board on SMF ?!

2)
Are the words 'form' and 'forum' used interchangeably in the site (it rather looks that way...) ?

3)
Is the news/blog feature built right in so it does not need to be added ?

4)
Is there any way to import a static, already existing site ?

Thanks you - and I hope my questions are not too stupid !

[pcwacht]

if this tool has it's own built-in forum/board module(s), then why is this board on SMF ?!

No, and that's why this is smf

Are the words 'form' and 'forum' used interchangeably in the site

Form is a WB core module to make forms wich visitors can enter data with
Forum is where you are at now, indeed two different things.

Is the news/blog feature built right in so it does not need to be added ?

News is a core module, so it ois build in.
You can enhance the blog-like look and feel with a drop[let named blogmenu

Is there any way to import a static, already existing site ?

Nope, but it is very easy to do it by hand (copy paste), or linking to existing html pages with the menulink wich is build in.

For you first sentence ->

putting up a blog for some time, and maybe also a discussion board

Blog, with wb very easy
Discussion board, not (yet) with core wb. Depending on you rneeds most of the time it is better to use a BIG forum like phorum, smf, phpbb or one of the others.
For WB there are many addons, look at amasp for example. -> http://www.websitebakers.com/


Have fun,
John

[smallhagrid]

Thank You So Much John !
Your reply helped me HUGELY with my need to understand.

And looking at AMASP as you suggested showed me :
http://www.websitebakers.com/pages/modules/interaction/jk-forum.php
Which looks wonderful too !

2 more questions, if I may ?

a)Is there a WB specific tool for creating whole-site backups - or one that anyone would recommend ?

b) I have also a desire to store a collection of info of interest to myself online so I may use it anyplace I may be.

For this I have experimented with phpBB and managed to also break it beyond repair whilst trying to make it private and secure...the question:

Is there any sort of add-on or settings panel in WB for implementing such privacy/security as to make an area or site for only a single user's access ?

Thanks, and Best Wishes.

mark

[crnogorac081]

Hi,

there is a backup module, but it backups only database and not files.. so you would have to copy /pages and /media folders (default) by yourself..

WB has user/group management, so you can create groups and give them certain permissions: to view or edit certain pages and then you create user accounts and put them in theese groups

I hope it helped
cheers

[sky writer]

And looking at AMASP as you suggested showed me :
http://www.websitebakers.com/pages/modules/interaction/jk-forum.php
Which looks wonderful too !

I would be very careful relying on this module.  I have tried it in the past and had major issues.  It never worked properly, and when uninstalled, it broke all the connections (links from short description to long) of my regular News module.  Iit was a major headache to repair.

[smallhagrid]

My hopes have been deflated, thanks:

I would be very careful relying on this module.  I have tried it in the past and had major issues.  It never worked properly, and when uninstalled, it broke all the connections (links from short description to long) of my regular News module.  Iit was a major headache to repair.

Another one rides the bus.

Is there a better forum/board choice you may suggest then ?

Thanks.

[sky writer]

That was just my experience.  You might read, and post a question here:
http://www.websitebaker2.org/forum/index.php/topic,12307.25.html

I always liked phpBB when I ran forums, but I no longer do this.  So, if I were to implement a forum, I would use the Wrapper Module and wrap a phpBB.

[Argos]

I'm a huge WB fan and heavy user, but what you ask for are exactly the weakest things of WB... 

There is currently no built in, native WB forum. All forum modules are old, incomplete, buggy and basic. I recommend you stay away from them, unless you are a developer and want to improve them.

Acces and rights management is possible with WB, and it works if you need basic stuff that you set and forget, but it's kinda rudimentary and not very user friendly. So if your site depends heavily on dynamic access rights management, you'll probably be disappointed and frustrated with WB after some time.

Blogs are possible by using the News module (which is rather nice and flexible), but it's not a full fledged ready to go blog platform like wordpress or something. It will be be rather basic, and I would not use it myself it myself if blogging will be a major site function.

So blogging, forum, and acces rights are not WB's strong points. WB is great for general small to midsized sites, but it falls short in the social communications department, I'm sorry to say. You'd probably better off with another system.

[smallhagrid]

Wow.
If I hadn't been talked out of using WB already I might be now !!!

Just to make it clear - the blog ambition IS a very basic one (no media - just text) and would be in a domain I haven't even gotten yet.
I looked at possibly using WordPress as the basis for a site but frankly I tried it once before and just didn't like it much at all.

Drupal seems more like taking on a new career than just a thing to make a site and/or blog with; and Expression Engine costs $ that I have no desire to spend, so:
With the zillion choices available I got really stuck at deciding which blog software to use !?!
Then add in another zillion or so possible CMS choices and I felt like I just needed a NAP  !!!!!!!!

I already have a site with a broken installation of phpBB like I said before and have tried a few BB programs only to find that they are mostly alot of different stuff to learn - hard to back-up, and when they break are almost impossible to restore (which is why mine is broken and staying that way until I wipe it off completely...).

I was attracted to WB because I don't want this to become a career choice; learning any more HTML, PHP or CSS than is absolutely necessary just does not interest me at all.

The BB idea would be on a totally separate site from the blog - and nobody would be there by invitation - it would be JUST for my own use and would ONLY need security against unwelcome visitors (everyone else but me).

That is precisely why a very basic forum/BB module would be OK for THAT idea. so:

1)
For a very basic blog with the ability of visitors to simply add comments - is the news module OK ?

2)
For simple info storage & finding at a later date on a one-man ONLY site is there a WB forum module which is simple, searchable, restorable from back-up AND securable enough for one man to use alone ?

Thanks for pitching in and teaching me about this - you are great folks here !!!

mark

[smallhagrid]

I've looked around at other CMS options before I found WB and my conclusion is that the array of choices is just baffling !

The other top choices seemed to be CMSMS, PHP-Fusion and Joomla and ultimately I'd like to choose one that is simple enough and also general-purpose with good features WITHOUT having to make a career of it.

If other users here really think WB is a poor choice for me I'd appreciate detailed recommendations for better alternates, please ?

Thank you.

[Argos]

Wow.
If I hadn't been talked out of using WB already I might be now !!!

Well, just trying to prevent disillusions... As I said, I love WB, but it's not the best CMS for all purposes.

For a very basic blog with the ability of visitors to simply add comments - is the news module OK ?

Yes, but beware of the fact that it has no monthly archive feature like a blog normally has. You can create that manually with some modifications though.

For simple info storage & finding at a later date on a one-man ONLY site is there a WB forum module which is simple, searchable, restorable from back-up AND securable enough for one man to use alone ?

I'm not sure I understand you. As is mentioned above, there is a backup for the database, but that doesn't backup your installation and content files on the http server. And there are a few basic forum modules (that I think are not well suited for current WB version, or are still in their infant stage), but you should test them to see if they work and may fit your needs.

Just spend a few hours to install WB and test some stuff. The proof of the pudding is in the eating.

[smallhagrid]

Thank you Argos, for helping me to get things clear about this !

Yes, but beware of the fact that it has no monthly archive feature like a blog normally has. You can create that manually with some modifications though.

I see that this has a simple solution - so I thank you again for good info !

I'm not sure I understand you. As is mentioned above, there is a backup for the database, but that doesn't backup your installation and content files on the http server. And there are a few basic forum modules (that I think are not well suited for current WB version, or are still in their infant stage), but you should test them to see if they work and may fit your needs.

Just spend a few hours to install WB and test some stuff. The proof of the pudding is in the eating.

What I am after is actually several different things->
For a new site I've yet to put up...blogging.
For my personal/private usage - info storage & access...
And for any site I put up for either sort of thing - full & reliable & complete back-up !

I'd like to find solutions for what I've been seeking and just.... stay with them permanently - but I haven't found what I really need yet.

In this stretched out search I've been told over and over to 'just install' this or that and spend a few hours trying it out & learning to configure it; I did that a dozen or so times until I saw how much of my life was wasted on things I could have asked about instead; so now I don't get excited anymore nor do I rush to install anything either...I ask lots of questions first THEN....MAYBE I'll try something.

And all that is why I haven't rushed right into installing/configuring WB just yet; and I haven't even asked any questions or located the user forums for PHP-Fusion or Joomla, which are my other 'possibles'...

Thanks for being so helpful !

PS - just an added FYI for anyone that it may help:
I've had my 'main' personal site at 000webhost.com for some time now. They -were- quite good, but now my site is down more than up and their site claims 'all servers are 100% fine' -> and when they are asked about the down-time they say '-just- upgrade to the $5/month plan and all will be well...'.
NOT GOING TO HAPPEN !
My theory:
If a free web-host cannot keep their free service running most of the time then I will not PAY them to be a hostage of a nearly as bad - but paid service !!!

[Argos]

What do you mean with "info storage & access"?

[pcwacht]

My guess: Creating pages with info wich can be seen only by validated user

But I might be wrong....

I've been told over and over to 'just install' this or that and spend a few hours trying it out & learning to configure it;

I think you'll be please d with WB, it doesn't need a learning curve. It is simple.

Rereading stuff written here I think you'll can do everything with wb. Only thing wich can't be done is having a WB-forum. For a real forum revert to one of the 'big' forums and put it in a wrapper or make a template wich simulars your webpages.

Have fun,
John
 

[smallhagrid]

Hello again folks.

What do you mean with "info storage & access"?

As I'd posted waaay up there^:

b) I have also a desire to store a collection of info of interest to myself online so I may use it anyplace I may be.

For this I have experimented with phpBB and managed to also break it beyond repair whilst trying to make it private and secure...the question:

Is there any sort of add-on or settings panel in WB for implementing such privacy/security as to make an area or site for only a single user's access ?

And->

My guess: Creating pages with info wich can be seen only by validated user
But I might be wrong....

Yes - but also in a format similar to (the now dead) Luminotes, or a program I tried called Zim, or even like a board as in phpBB (but minus it's fragility...).

I think you'll be please d with WB, it doesn't need a learning curve. It is simple.
Rereading stuff written here I think you'll can do everything with wb. Only thing wich can't be done is having a WB-forum. For a real forum revert to one of the 'big' forums and put it in a wrapper or make a template wich simulars your webpages.

Thanks !

I have some time yet before I'll commit to one thing or the other - and questions yet unanswered about other CMSs I am considering - but truly - thus far, WB does seem best suited to my needs if only I can get some way to solve my personal info storage need (and to associate it with WB) that will work for me...I spent too much time fiddling with different forum options months ago and they really left me disappointed.

[sky writer]

After chatting (publicly and privately) and trying to understand the base needs you are after, and failing to somewhat, I think your wants are so particular and personal, that you will have to either try out WB first hand, or you will never know if it does all the things you want, the way you want them to function.

Can I ask a question, which is not meant as an insult in any way.  Are you a technically inclined person?  The reason I ask is that you refer to phpBB being fragile and breaking and other programs being slow and other attempts to install many trial options in the past as being failed.  Personally, I have always found phpBB to be rock solid and very robust.  And so I wonder if you are simply looking for a simple solution to a very complex need.  In other words, maybe you don't understand what goes on behind the scenes of some of the programs (Zim) for instance, which allow you to do what seems like simple work-flows.

As I and others have said, you CAN accomplish everything you seem to be after with WB.  But it will take effort on your part to work with WB, find the limitations, and then come back with more questions to find answers here that might allow you to get it to a state that works for you.

Hope this helps.  Good luck.

[Argos]

I think I understand you now. There are many free and paid online services out there where you can store personal info. WB is not made for such a functionality. Again, you could use it with some modules and a bit of hacking around, but it won't be optimal. The system would be both overkill and falling short. Overkill in features you won't need, and short on features you will need.

[smallhagrid]

Sky Writer I think you are a very wise person indeed:

After chatting (publicly and privately) and trying to understand the base needs you are after, and failing to somewhat, I think your wants are so particular and personal, that you will have to either try out WB first hand, or you will never know if it does all the things you want, the way you want them to function.

How purr-fectly delightful !!!:

Can I ask a question, which is not meant as an insult in any way.  Are you a technically inclined person?

I salute you upon your wonderful perceptivity - you've pegged me very neatly and completely.

My work & training is technical - but what I am NOT is a coder; that is a career choice I made many years ago and have stuck with it, so instead of making such solutions I always find that someone, someplace has already found or made a solution and that way I do not re-invent the wheel.

Yes:

...you refer to phpBB being fragile and breaking and other programs being slow and other attempts to install many trial options in the past as being failed. 

I am not shy about finding strings when I know juuuust enough HTML - and either changing them or deleting (to create changes) if it looks non-essential to my non-coders eyes. I know what I've done when I did it and can usually reverse that pretty easily.
That was not what I did wrong.

Specifically how I broke phpBB was by accidentally applying a theme that was a single version short; my own error as I got it from the community site rather than the author's site (which had the correct one).
When I posted asking how to fix it - and followed the directions perfectly even that did not work, so I quit at it.

This is possibly a very good summing-up:

And so I wonder if you are simply looking for a simple solution to a very complex need.

Or maybe just something new - a new combination of existing things...or

As to Zim:

  In other words, maybe you don't understand what goes on behind the scenes of some of the programs (Zim) for instance, which allow you to do what seems like simple work-flows.

It is a Linux-native program ported over to windows with all of it's dependencies included.
As such it is very slow when just running with local data storage-> but when the layer of webdav is added in for internet data storage it gets incredibly slow because there are just too many layers (this is probably the main reason why webdav is not more popular in general, actually).

Thank you - I appreciate your wisdom and willingness to help very much:

As I and others have said, you CAN accomplish everything you seem to be after with WB.  But it will take effort on your part to work with WB, find the limitations, and then come back with more questions to find answers here that might allow you to get it to a state that works for you.
Hope this helps.  Good luck.

Thanks Argos:

I think I understand you now. There are many free and paid online services out there where you can store personal info.

Yes, there are - but very little or nothing specifically for use upon one's own hosting - and as an author-in-waiting I find I am very uncomfortable storing years and years of collected info on some service's space.

Here's an example: I could have easily stored and accessed the sorts of stuff I have via the Luminotes service/site...BUT-> when they killed that off I would have been severely stuck and I do not want that possibility at all.

If...:

WB is not made for such a functionality. Again, you could use it with some modules and a bit of hacking around, but it won't be optimal. The system would be both overkill and falling short. Overkill in features you won't need, and short on features you will need.

I could get the privacy/security I desire for my personal project, it would be fine via phpBB; for the blog ambition I have already seen it will do exactly what is needed - and I will approach my backup needs from yet another angle to be sure that is well covered.

My thanks & I hope someone might explain to me if and/or how I could secure an instance of phpBB, which I posted about in another thread.

[Argos]

This is not the right place to ask support for phpBB I'm afraid... We can and will try to help you with WB, but not with software that's outside the WB realm.

We already answered your questions quite thoroughly, even if we had a hard time understanding you. But now's the time you put some effort in yourself, install WB, work with it, and then ask relevant questions again if you like. OK?

[smallhagrid]

You've misunderstood me:

This is not the right place to ask support for phpBB I'm afraid... We can and will try to help you with WB, but not with software that's outside the WB realm.

We already answered your questions quite thoroughly, even if we had a hard time understanding you. But now's the time you put some effort in yourself, install WB, work with it, and then ask relevant questions again if you like. OK?

What I am asking is how to secure WB to create a log-in ON TOP OF phpBB; and I've asked that in the other thread I posted.
I already know with certainty that phpBB cannot provide a separate log-in and as long as it's top page can be seen unwanted visitors can manipulate it quite easily, which defeats any privacy/security.

Thanks for your time and efforts in answering me - I do very much appreciate the education.

[pcwacht]

how to secure WB to create a log-in ON TOP OF phpBB

Here I need to give some extra info.

1 - PHPBB or any other Forum etc is a separate installed package
2 - since it is installed separate there allways be a direct url (www.domain.com/forum for example)

No cms can really secure that
Yes you can use a cms to wrap the forum (iframes) but it allways be direct available.

I would create a .htaccess in the folder where the forum software is installed to keep everybody out.
It is the best way.


But if you only need a forum just to enter some information only you need to see you might use the news module for it within WB and set it to private, this way it is only visible after logged in.
And the news module allso give you the oportunity to add comments etc. so it will mimic a rudimentary forum.

John
 

[smallhagrid]

Hi John and thanks !
After getting scolded soundly here multiple times - and trying the new help site only to find that it has been down for a day or 2 - I just continued searching for solutions which suit me.

My need IS rather particular despite the fact that I suspect that MANY people would enjoy the sort of facility I am trying to create for myself.

Given how many folks have their own sites these days AND also happen to live/work/etc. using multiple locations, I think that especially middle-aged folks (like me) would love to have a way to easily and privately keep info snippets on their own site for reference and re-use anytime and from anyplace.
As of right now I have found no easy way to create this solution - but just today some of the bits needed have gotten ALOT clearer in my searching.

Thanks again !

[pcwacht]

Shame to see you got scolded.

Given how many folks have their own sites these days AND also happen to live/work/etc. using multiple locations, I think that especially middle-aged folks (like me) would love to have a way to easily and privately keep info snippets on their own site for reference and re-use anytime and from anyplace.

Well being 52-ish myself I can see that point.
Since my work is IT related I allways use remote desktop behind a firewall with intrusion detection to keep my info save away so I can reach it wherever I am as long as there is a descent internet connection.

For snippets I used (! - no time to refill my new sitelayout etc) my website, where I used public for unharmfull bits and private for harmfull bits.
 
Glad to see your quest has ended.

John

[Argos]

After getting scolded soundly here multiple times - and trying the new help site only to find that it has been down for a day or 2 - I just continued searching for solutions which suit me.

Scolded? Where? When?
New help site that has been down? What site do you mean?

I think you are looking for a organizer or PIM script, instead of a forum or a CMS. Have a look at http://www.hotscripts.com/category/php/scripts-programs/organizers/

[smallhagrid]

I first posted here initially/mostly to find out if WB could do a blog site for me - and for that EXACT usage it will be perfect.
This will be on a domain I got very cheaply for just a year which shall reside upon my own hosting; and if it gets used well I shall consider renewing it - if not - pffft - a learning for me.

With regards to my online snippet storage ambition:
My quest has by no means ended - but I am making progress in finding bits and summer is my time to do most of my web-work (so that I stay indoors and safely cool).

I am mostly seeking to solve the privacy - security - and general form of storage aspects, so that IF (for example) I should decide to try phpBB for the storage medium once again, I will have found a very good way to hide and/or secure it from anyone's use except for my own.

There are many ways to go about obtaining the desired privacy & security but until today nothing felt like any sort of 'fit'.
However I did find what I consider to be a very elegant way to accomplish both via some very nice obfuscation just today, and in a manner which is sooo dated and crazy that it is likely to simply be ignored; a perfect solution IMO !!!

With regards to scolding...I find that folks are very, very touchy when they have ownership or administer any webspace/domain, board etc. - and doubly so when anything is asked which may request that they exceed their desired depth - AND, that it is also irrelevant how politely any such request may be made from what I have seen.

One good example in my travels has been picky-fussiness about little cute trinkets and such being used in posts; this just makes me snicker...heavy handedness about such things when embellishments ARE right in the reply forms at most forums ? Ach, rules and rules and rules - some folks just need to LIGHTEN UP !!!

Since I work as a tech but have ZERO desire to branch off into coding - or to spend days on end re-doing stuff that will not work, I tend to ask ALOT of questions too...which also puts folks on edge from what I've noticed.

Anyways - when I get slapped around or scolded or whatever (and answers no longer seem to be forthcoming) - my response is simply to make a mental note that help is limited in regards to (whatever) and then move on.
No biggie.
(I'd rather use my time learning what the limitations are in something than immersing my brain in anything which will need wiping away later...)

This quest of mine has gone on for quite a while now - and I've wasted LOTS of time/life on various solutions which turned out to have serious weaknesses or that were poor fits despite initial impressions; realizing that has shown me NOT to be in a hurry, especially when I've been in touch with a coder who is -slowly- working to get Luminotes ready for use on private hosting and is willing to share it when ready, which would be VERY cool indeed !!!

With regards to:
http://www.hotscripts.com/category/php/scripts-programs/organizers/

I spent LOTS of time there (read ALL 6 or more pages of those scripts & visited their sites too) and at alternate script-listing sites to see if what I sought was already existing, and did not find anything remotely resembling my example local or hosted variations.

I also searched extensively for hosted 'note-taking' apps/scripts.

Problem is - there isn't (yet ?) even a category for 'online snippet storage' for one's own hosting - maybe it will appear though and I'd sure enjoy THAT !

Best Wishes.